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Re: War of Rights - Kick Starter
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MinnPost
What if Lincoln had allowed the South to secede?
12 APR 2011
by Eric Black

"On this date, a century and a half ago, Confederate forces fired on Fort Sumter, on an island off the coast of South Carolina. The Confederate States of America asserted not only their right to secede but also to claim federal property within their borders. The newly inaugurated U.S. president, Abraham Lincoln, rejected both claims and refused to evacuate Sumter.

"Plainly, the central idea of secession is the essence of anarchy,” Lincoln had said in his somber inaugural address a month earlier. “A majority, held in restraint by constitutional checks and limitations and always changing easily with deliberate changes of popular opinions and sentiments,..."


My comments on the first paragraph and a half

1. if Lincoln had 'allowed'
Thoughts: Does anyone else have a say?
Or, do all the decisions get made by only one person?
Event: President Lincoln was sworn into office to protect and defend the U.S. Constitution on 4 MAR 1861

2. "Confederate forces fired on Fort Sumter"
Thoughts: Provoked or unprovoked?
Event: Bombardment of Fort Sumter, Charleston, South Carolina on 12 and 13 APR 1861
Additional Details:
- DEC 1860, South Carolina demanded the military facilities of Charleston harbor be abandoned by federal military forces
- 9 JAN 1861, An unarmed Union merchant vessel attempts to reinforce Fort Sumter.
- MAR 1861, The South sent delegations to Washington, D.C. seeking a peaceful resolution. Lincoln rejected negotiations.
- 30 MAR 1861, USRC Harriet Lane transferred to U.S. Navy service
- 4 APR 1861, Lincoln ordered a naval force to Ft. Sumter
... 3 warships (USS Pawnee, USS Powhatan, USS Pocahontas), USRC Harriet Lane, Baltic Steamer, three tug boats with barges, 300 sailors, and 200 troops
- 6 APR 1861, Lincoln notified the Governor of South Carolina
- 11 APR 1861, Confederate military delegation confers with Ft. Sumter
- 11 APR 1861, USRC Harriet fired on civilian merchant ship Nashville outside of Charleston harbor
- On Friday, April 12, 1861, at 4:30 a.m., Confederate batteries opened fire. The bombardment continued for 34 hours.

3. "Confederate States of America asserted"

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The legislative bodies of numerous States voted and the States individually made the decision to preserve their way of life:

20 DEC 1860 - South Carolina
(2 JAN 1861 - Claiborne Fox Jackson became governor of Missouri)
9 JAN 1861 - Mississippi
10 JAN 1861 - Florida
11 JAN 1861 - Alabama
19 JAN 1861 - Georgia
26 JAN 1861 - Louisiana

1 FEB 1861 - Texas
[Referendum on 23 FEB 46,153 to 14,747 in favor of secession]
4 FEB 1861 - Confederate States of America formed a new government
(4 MAR 1861 New U.S. President)
(12-13 APR 1861 Fort Sumter)
(15 APR 1861 - Lincoln called for Missouri to provide four reginments.
Missouri Governor C.F. Jackson's response:"Your requisition, in my judgment, is illegal,
unconstitutional, and revolutionary in its object, inhuman, and diabolical and cannot be
complied with. Not one man will the State of Missouri furnish to carry on any unholy
crusade." Kentucky Governor Beriah Magoffin's response: "I will send not a man nor a
dollar for the wicked purpose of subduing my sister Southern States.")
17 APR 1861 - Virginia [Referendum on 23 MAY 132,201 to 37,451 in favor of secession]
(18 & 19 APR 1861 - Baltimore, Maryland forcefully occupied by Union troops)
(22 APR 1861 - Annapolis, Maryland State Capital, occupied by Union troops)
(29 APR 1861 - Maryland State Legislature directed no Union troops to transit through the state)

6 MAY 1861 - Arkansas & Tennessee [TN Referendum on 8 JUN 104,471 to 47,183 in favor of secession]
20 MAY 1861 - North Carolina
(23 MAY 1861 West Virginia seceded from the State of Virginia)
(5 JUL 1861 - Missouri Governor C.F. Jackson led 6,000 State Guardsmen against Union forces)
31 OCT 1861 - Missouri
20 NOV 1861 - Kentucky
28 NOV 1861 - Missouri was recognized as the 12th State to enter the Confederacy
10 DEC 1861 - Kentucky was recognized as the 13th State to enter the Confederacy

4. "asserted not only their right to secede but also to claim federal property within
their borders"

Thoughts: What a silly thing to say. Did the author read this before sending it to the
printing press?

5. The newly inaugurated U.S. president ... rejected ... [the] claims [of multiple
states].
Thoughts: The statement above was reworded. Perhaps, the rhetoric of the 'new guy'
instigated a forceful action.

6. "Plainly, the central idea of secession is the essence of anarchy,” Lincoln had said in
his somber inaugural address a month earlier.

Thoughts: Sounds like a challenge from a dictator. Reinforces the instigation theory.

7. "held in restraint by constitutional checks and limitations"
Thoughts: That lasted a little bit longer than the length of his speech.
Events:
13 MAY - 27 JUN 1861 - Baltimore mayor, city council, chief of police, and the board of
police were arrested by Union troops.

1 JUN 1861 - U.S. federal circuit court in Maryland led by Chief Justice Roger Taney ruled
the arrests were unconstitutional without Congressional authorization. U.S. Supreme Court
Chief raged at length against Lincoln for granting himself easily abused powers and wrote
"in order that he might perform his constitutional duty, to enforce the laws, by securing
obedience to the process of the United States"

7 AUG 1861 - Members of the state legislature of Maryland were arbitrarily arrested by Union troops
25 AUG 1861 - Mayor of the District of Colombia, James G. Barret, arrested
13 SEP 1861 - U.S. Congressman Henry May representing Maryland arrested
13 SEP 1861 - Baltimore Daily Exchange Newspaper editors (Frank Key Howard, W.W. Glenn,
Thomas W. Hall, and S.S. Mills) were arrested
17 SEP 1861 - 27 Maryland state legislatures arrested by Union troops
20 SEP 1861 - Maryland Speaker of the House of Delegates was arrested

No arrest warrants were issued from a judge or charges filed.

Thoughts: Can a U.S. citizen having committed no crimes be allowed to leave and live the rest of his life in another nation?
The Federal government was formed by a convention of former British colonies.
Why can't the legal State legislative bodies with the consent of the governed have the authority to separate from the Federal government?

Posted on: 2015/11/16 1:11
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Re: War of Rights - Kick Starter
#12
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Good thoughtful comments, Scriv. To answer your question,

Why can't the legal State legislative bodies with the consent of the governed have the authority to separate from the Federal government?

...because the Constitution, which was ratified by all the states, provides no legal avenue to do so. The founding fathers did not add any language regarding dissolution intentionally, knowing that to do so would likely lead to the eventual end of the union. The Constitution could be amended to make it legal and that is certainly an avenue the southern states could have pursued.




Posted on: 2015/11/16 3:46
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Re: War of Rights - Kick Starter
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Quote:
...the Constitution, ...provides no legal avenue to ... [dissolve] the union...

The U.S. Constitution did not prohibit State secession. So, there is a 'legal' right for the governed citizenry to separate from a tyrannical central government.

Maryland governor Thomas Holliday Hicks wrote to Lincoln on April 22, 1861, informing the new U.S. President that "I feel it my duty most respectfully to advise you that no more troops be ordered or allowed to pass through Maryland", and requested that Lincoln obtain a truce with the South and suggested that Lord Lyons mediate.

The ends do not justify the means.

Approximately, 750,000 dead Americans.

Were all peaceful measures exhausted?

The election of Abraham Lincoln in 1860 was the immediate cause of southern resolutions of secession from the Union.

Posted on: 2015/11/16 3:53
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Re: War of Rights - Kick Starter
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The purpose of the Constitution pursues a "perpetual, more perfect Union," no mere alliance or voluntary pact among sovereign states. The States retained all the power they did not grant. But each State, having expressly parted with so many powers as to constitute, jointly with the other States, a single nation, can not, from that period, possess any right to secede, because such secession does not break a league, but destroys the unity of a nation." The concept of unilateral secession contradicts the very concept of Federalism and the balance of powers inherent to the Founders' intentions and the nature of this country.

The Constitution never explicitly reserves the right of secession, as it logically shouldn't. As James Madison said, "It must not be forgotten, that compact, express or implied is the vital principle of free Governments as contradistinguished from Governments not free; and that a revolt against this principle leaves no choice but between anarchy and despotism." Sanctifying the right for individual, unilateral secession of states either in letter or in spirit defeats the very purpose of the Constitution and reduces the bonds holding the nation together to "ropes of sand." Reserving the right of secession indefinitely also reduces the federal government and all other states in the union to pointlessness as their wishes can be arbitrarily defied at a whim with threats of secession.


Posted on: 2015/11/16 17:53
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Re: War of Rights - Kick Starter
#15
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15 JUN 1215 - Magna Carta
16 DEC 1689 - English Bill of Rights

9 MAY 1754 - Join or Die
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This cartoon was used in the French and Indian War to symbolize that the colonies needed to join together with Great Britain to defeat the French and Indians. It became a symbol of colonial freedom during the American Revolutionary War.

1754–1763 - French and Indian War

6 DEC 1773 - Boston Tea Party
FEB 1775 - Massachusetts declared in a state of rebellion
19 APR 1775 - Battle of Lexington
12 JUN 1776 - Virginia Declaration of Rights
4 JUL 1776 - Declaration of Independence

1 MAR 1781 - U.S. Articles of Confederation
19 OCT 1781 - British forces surrender at Yorktown
3 SEP 1783 - Treaty of Paris

21 JUN 1786 - U.S. Constitution
1788 - The Federalist Papers
15 DEC 1791 - Bill of Rights

Posted on: 2015/11/16 21:54
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Re: War of Rights - Kick Starter
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1 MAR 1781 - U.S. Articles of Confederation - unsuccessful because the central government lacked the necessary power to carry out its obligations.

19 JAN 1788 - Federalist Paper No. 41
General View of the Powers Conferred by the Constitution - The most important issue examines how much power did the people want to submit unto the government. Madison expresses concern that a standing force is dangerous to liberty, but at the same time is necessary to defend a nation. A prudent nation would balance the inconvenience of having an army with the danger of having an army capable of overthrowing the government. The additional balance is to keep liberty from being crushed between a standing army and perpetual taxes to support it.

15 DEC 1791 - U.S. Constitution Tenth Amendment
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
The 10th amendment preserves the state's authority in all matters not specifically granted to the federal government.

19 MAY 1828 - Tariff of 1828 (North benefits and the South suffers economically)
Designed to protect industry in the North. The South had to pay higher prices on imports, reduced access to British exports, and the tariff tax hampered the South's exports to Britain.

10 DEC 1832 - Proclamation to the People of South Carolina (Suck it up, South. Stop complaining.)
Rejects the insistence on state sovereignty and focuses on the preservation of the Union

Thoughts: Amazingly, similar issue of unfair tariffs. Sounds like the same justification used by the colonists for the American Revolution.

The U.S. Constitution is a contract ratified by individual States. Each State should have the right to end their participation in the contract. Especially, if the enforcement of the contract is unfair toward and unbeneficial for the State. Power resides in the will of the governed citizens.

Posted on: 2015/11/16 23:16
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Re: War of Rights - Kick Starter
#17
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Quote:
The 10th amendment preserves the state's authority in all matters not specifically granted to the federal government.


The mere fact that secession is not explicitly mentioned does not indicate its validity. Article I, Section 10 of the Constitution reads, "No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation...

Posted on: 2015/11/16 23:54
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Re: War of Rights - Kick Starter
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Quote:
McGuirk wrote: "No State shall enter into any ... Confederation...


This applies for sovereign states who voluntarily continue to desire to adhere to the contract. If the contract is legally dissolved by the state, then the contract is no longer binding. Eleven states discontinued the contract (seven states discontinued their participation in the Union prior to hostilities) and were forced at the barrel of a gun to re-enter the Union. Missouri and Kentucky desired neutrality and they too found themselves at the barrel of a gun. Many of the legal representatives of the people of Maryland were arrested to dissuade them from secession.


Posted on: 2015/11/17 0:02
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Re: War of Rights - Kick Starter
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If my understanding of contract law is correct, once two parties enter into a contract, (as the southern states did when they ratified the Constitution, giving the federal government authority over the states) they are legally bound by it. To unilaterally act, in the manner that they did, represented a breach of that contract and provided the legal footing for the federal government to act.

Posted on: 2015/11/17 14:23
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Re: War of Rights - Kick Starter
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This has been a good learning process as I have had to do research to present my side of the discussion.

It is also good to hear the other side of most debates.

Posted on: 2015/11/17 20:53
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